5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

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5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby AdricDePsycho » Mon Nov 23, 2015 1:09 am

http://www.cracked.com/article_23090_th ... exist.html

Oh just so many problems with this...
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby NathanLoiselle » Mon Nov 23, 2015 3:23 am

Do tell us what those problems are so I don't have to read the article.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby cmsellers » Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:06 am

@Nathan: The primary author is also named Nathan, so you really should read it to support him. That said, I'll oblige, because I read these sorts of articles for some reason, at least when they get linked here.

  1. TV shows depict sex as awesome for men and a mixed bag for women.
  2. Strong women keep becoming mothers.
  3. TV shows make PMS jokes.
  4. The only way for a woman on TV to be strong is by being manly.
  5. Only one in four writers are male, and that number has been mostly flat since the eighties.
They may actually have a point about the last one; too bad they felt the need to pad it with the first four points. They may also have a point about PMS jokes, but it's a point that belongs in an article about hackish writing.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby Kivutar » Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:22 am

It seemed really... all over the place.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby AdricDePsycho » Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:31 am

Two things I disagreed with (I'd have gone in depth but I had to get off my computer, and now I forgot most of my issues with it): a couple of their examples of PMS jokes were off (like the example from The Big Bang Theory), and I think they mentioned Lori from The Walking Dead (which, doesn't everyone who watches that show hate her?). I really don't feel like rereading it, and it'll all be a big waste of my time to go in depth at this time (I need to go to bed), so I'm leaving my examination for another time.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby NathanLoiselle » Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:33 am

I refuse to read, watch, or listen to anything by a Nathan. I'd rather not give them power as there can only be one Nathan and that's me! You hear me? I'll cut you Nathan! I'll cut you good!
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby sunglasses » Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:53 am

cmsellers wrote:@Nathan: The primary author is also named Nathan, so you really should read it to support him. That said, I'll oblige, because I read these sorts of articles for some reason, at least when they get linked here.

  1. TV shows depict sex as awesome for men and a mixed bag for women.
  2. Strong women keep becoming mothers.
  3. TV shows make PMS jokes.
  4. The only way for a woman on TV to be strong is by being manly.
  5. Only one in four writers are male, and that number has been mostly flat since the eighties.
They may actually have a point about the last one; too bad they felt the need to pad it with the first four points. They may also have a point about PMS jokes, but it's a point that belongs in an article about hackish writing.


1. Yeah, they do. It's irritating.
2. *sigh* Kinda? But why can't you be a strong woman and a mother? Why is it either/or?!
3. Yeah...
4. Yes. That's somewhat true but if they're too masculine they're considered a bitch.
5. dunno
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby cmsellers » Mon Nov 23, 2015 5:08 am

sunglasses wrote:
1. Yeah, they do. It's irritating.
2. *sigh* Kinda? But why can't you be a strong woman and a mother? Why is it either/or?!
3. Yeah...
4. Yes. That's somewhat true but if they're too masculine they're considered a bitch.
5. dunno

1. Doesn't it have a fair amount of truth to it though? Sex is still seen as an accomplishment for men, whereas it's something women give. You can argue as to whether it's biology or culture, but even if men and women enjoy sex equally, it seems like women do approach it much more carefully than men.

The article also complained about portraying women as victims of sexual crimes, but outside of prison, aren't women much more likely to be victims of sexual attacks than men?

4. Is Leslie Knope manly? Is Liz Lemon? Is Alicia Florrick? Admittedly, those characters are all the stars of the show. But what about Peggy Olsen, or Monica from Silicon Valley or any of the women on Catching Fire? They're all strong and none of them literally kick but in the same way that Korra does.

They may have a point about Skylar White, but my issue with her is that she was hypocritical. She could have turned Walter in, but instead she tried to contain him because of the sweet, sweet dosh he was bringing in.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby Deathclaw_Puncher » Mon Nov 23, 2015 5:50 am

That fourth point is something that tries to be done, but falls victim to our unpleasable culture of outrage. Write a female character just as you would a male character? You're denying femininity. Make her a tomboy with a girly streak? You're conforming to gender stereotypes. She's a strong character who likes sex? She's just a slut that's fodder for people who like Korra-physiqued characters. But you can't make her reserved or awkward about sex either, then you're denying female sexuality. And don't you dare make her gay or bi and write her sans stereotypes, then she's only tough because she's not straight. But you can't make her straight, because you're not acknowledging the LGBT community!

I think it really just comes down to mix of people just wanting to complain, people who have good intentions, but aren't exactly sure what the hell they want, and people who fall victim to the whole representation-based creative sterility thing, where character development, personality, and narrative fall by the wayside in favor of representation, which is quite problematic when people want a perfect representation of feminism, yet can't agree on what is and isn't feminist.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby Tesseracts » Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:36 am

I think it comes down to this: is this character interesting? Is she someone I would want to know in real life? Does she have ANY distinguishable personality traits other than being a woman? Would I still enjoy her personality if she was male?

For many women characters, the answer is no. Many are just interchangeable stereotypes, and for many women characters their only purpose is to be pretty and inspire men to watch a show with pretty women.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby octoberpumpkin » Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:43 pm

I liked the article, actually. I've had my fair share of men say "Oh is it almost period time? Guess I'd better get ready for your mood swings!" which I mean, isn't any of their business and isn't even accurate? What?

Being active in some of the video game community, I see a lot of number 4. Like "oh she's a bad character because she stopped to take care of her friend who was in a coma" (video games are dramatic, okay?). But I mean, if it had been a dude, he would be caring dude, so why can't she just be a caring lady? And if she hadn't stayed back with him, she would have been a cold bitch. Just stuff like that.

A recent example is a trailer for an upcoming game. As usual, there is a male lead and a female lead. The male lead has been shown going through a lot of crap. The female lead was recently shown being attacked as a young girl. SO MANY PEOPLE were taking a fit like "oh sure, because she's a woman she's going to get raped." and then they were saying its either lazy writing or sexist. They kept saying that they've made a weak femle character. A) we don' know if it was rape, we just saw her attacked B) It very well could be lazy writing but we don't have context yet to see how it's handled C) the male lead has been attacked and his father dies and things like that but no one is calling that cliche or lazy and D) it's insulting to women who have been through abuse to insinuate that that makes them "weak". You can go through that and make it through to the other side and that actually makes you strong. I am super insulted by that actually.

I'm just kind of rambling, but you get my point. It seems you can't write a female character because it will, in some way, be sexist. You can't write a woman who likes "girly" things, even though lots of women like "girly" things, and that's okay. Or who likes to cook. Just you know, have some variety. If ALL women are being portrayed that way, it's a problem. But having certain women act in a stereotypically feminine way? Well, some women do. And that's okay too
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby Tesseracts » Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:15 pm

#5. TV's Portrayal Of Female Sexuality Is (Still) Messed Up

Female characters seem far more likely to be brutally raped than to initiate and enjoy casual sex ... as if we're more comfortable with the former.


Seem more likely? Well, is it more likely or not? I'd like to see numbers. I strongly suspect this is wrong. It certainly doesn't seem like female characters are more likely to be raped than have enjoyable sex to me, although this may be because much of my media consumption is comedy. Still, I hardly think "brutal rape" is a common thing on television. Not every show is GoT. (Although GoT is genuinely kind of fucked up and the article is right to bring it up.)

Sometimes it's played for laughs ("I bet our weird friend Steve has a dead hooker in his basement!"), and sometimes it's dramatic ("I bet our weird suspect Steve has a dead hooker in his basement"). Either way, the message is the same: Women (or girls) getting sexually exploited is either hilarious or kind of their own fault.


Is Cracked living in the same universe I live in? Rape is almost always portrayed as an extreme tragedy, 100% morally unjustifiable. Rarely do I see it depicted as either funny (unless the victim is male) or the fault of the victim. Victim blaming is common in real life, but any TV show which engages in victim blaming will face a lot of backlash.

#4. TV Women No Longer Have To Be Mothers, Except They Totally Do

Parks' Leslie and The Mindy Project's Mindy also both got saddled with kids in later seasons, seemingly out of a desire to check a box on the "female character development" list, rather than because it made any logical sense.


Okay, wow. I have never watched The Mindy Project, but I know it was created by Mindy Kaling because she wanted to live the great American dream of creating a TV show starring herself. She's a huge feminist, and yes, a woman. If she wants to give herself a fictional baby, what right do we have to say it makes "no logical sense?" What the hell?!

Why does Cracked so consistently fail at being feminist?

#3. Menstruation Still Transforms Women Into Disgusting Emotional Basket Cases

I'm not going to argue with this one. It's a dumb joke and Family Guy is the most sexist show ever. Even taking into account their shtick is being offensive, the sheer amount of rape jokes and sexist jokes in Family Guy is boggling.

#2. We Hate Female Characters Who Aren't The Right Kind Of "Strong"

The examples they use here don't make any sense. Apparently we aren't allowed to dislike Lena Dunham or Sarah Jessica Parker. Why? Because they're "strong women" apparently. But we ARE allowed to dislike Mindy Kaling for taking on the dreaded role of "parent."

#1. There Aren't That Many Women Making Shows

This one has a point, but it keeps praising Girls. Gross.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby AdricDePsycho » Mon Nov 23, 2015 7:10 pm

I don't know what this Girls is, but it sounds disappointing.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby Taluun » Mon Nov 23, 2015 7:33 pm

AdricDePsycho wrote:I don't know what this Girls is, but it sounds disappointing.


If you want to watch a show about a bunch of upper middle class girls in there 20's complaining about how tough their life is then you will love it.

The only people who I have personally met who love it also seem to fit that description or arent far from it. A general lack of self-awareness almost seems required to enjoy it.
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Re: 5 Weird Ways You Didn't Realize TV is Sexist

Postby AdricDePsycho » Mon Nov 23, 2015 7:55 pm

Taluun wrote:
AdricDePsycho wrote:I don't know what this Girls is, but it sounds disappointing.


If you want to watch a show about a bunch of upper middle class girls in there 20's complaining about how tough their life is then you will love it.

The only people who I have personally met who love it also seem to fit that description or aren't far from it. A general lack of self-awareness almost seems required to enjoy it.

And this show is critically acclaimed?

There goes self-awareness then, I guess.
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