7 Real Horrible School Assignments

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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby rowdyrodimus » Sat Jul 25, 2015 2:28 pm

You know, I'm more comfortable with #7 (the Holocaust debate) than I was with what my Government teacher in high school did. He was a card carrying liberal, he proclaimed it loudly and proudly. If you were a conservative, he viewed you as a mortal enemy. We were discussing WWII and we got to the Holocaust. A few of us brought up if the actual numbers were right as they didn't seem to fit the numbers of Jews in the area the Nazi's had control over. We weren't saying it didn't happen just maybe that the numbers had been inflated some. Well, as soon as it came to our tests, all of us that had questioned the official numbers of the Holocaust had just enough points deducted from our essay question (which wasn't about the Holocaust) for us to make F's. Funny thing, if you just went with the portion of the test that had specific answers, we made the highest grades in the class. It wasn't until we graduated that one of us found out he was Jewish. It's just funny that even a teacher who is supposed to judge people based on their work will fail those students if they dare question The Chosen People.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby Tesseracts » Sat Jul 25, 2015 4:05 pm

#7
I hate this. From time to time I hear about some teacher that got in trouble for having kids debate about Nazis. Debating in favor of something you find morally wrong is a useful exercise and parents are being way too sensitive.

#6
This seems like a stupid joke. Teachers shouldn't be joking about sex toys with their students, but I doubt any real harm was done here.

#5
I noticed when I was a kid I seemed to get a lot of material with graphic violence and rape. I thought this was weird. Nobody in school would dare show a PG-13 movie in class without parental permission, but it's fine to make us read a story about a puppy being thrown in a sack with a weasel to fight to the death.

#4
This is the only one that makes me angry. Special education is pathetic and they don't even try to teach these kids anything because they think retarded kids can't learn. If my dog can learn how to do things other than dig through garbage so can your sped students.

#3
Okay, this makes me angry also. I hate it when teachers push their political agenda on students, especially when their agenda involves the fucking black panthers.

#2
If the parents medication is "private" maybe they shouldn't store it in the medicine cabinet that the entire family presumably uses. Especially if they think their kid will use the drugs to get high. However I don't think the school has any right to ask students what medications their parents take.

#1
...What?
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby rowdyrodimus » Sat Jul 25, 2015 6:25 pm

I've asked this before and never gotten an answer, only name calling and worse. This is a serious question that I don't understand and please remember, I'm not asking as a troll or someone who wants to prove a point but seriously don't understand this. Why is it horrible for someone to be Anti-Jew or Anti-Semitic (as most people say) but it's perfectly fine and acceptable to be Anit-Christianity? It seems to me that one would be as bad as the other, but if you are Anti-Semitic you are a bad person with no redeeming qualities but if you are Anti-Christian, you're cool and just a free thinker who has seen past the lies of religion. It makes no sense to me or is this just the way the world is now?
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby Marcuse » Sat Jul 25, 2015 6:29 pm

I don't agree it's okay to be anti-religious in that way any more than I think it's okay to be anti-semitic.

However, if I were to take a position for the sake of argument, religious belief is possible to change, being a Jew is not. Therefore expressing hatred for a group of people who have chosen to believe X is deploring the choice, rather than the being, which is the subject of hatred towards any racial group.

Again, I don't particularly enjoy or engage in the denigration of people of faith in general either. But for the sake of argument, there's a material difference between a faith and a race.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby rowdyrodimus » Sat Jul 25, 2015 6:46 pm

It's just something I've noticed more and more as a Catholic. I mean, anytime I mention being an altar boy, I have to add "Nothing Happened" or it will be nothing more than at least a dozen "Molesting Priest" jokes or accusations in the comments. I don't know, maybe it's because I believe in real equality and not the newer version of equality which is "everyone has these rights and freedoms but these certain groups get these added to them that others don't". I fully admit I see it from my point of view that others might not share but it seems nobody is willing to look in a mirror anymore before telling others their hair is messed up, you know?
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby archaeologydalek » Sat Jul 25, 2015 6:55 pm

REDACTED
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby AboveGL » Sat Jul 25, 2015 6:59 pm

Tesseracts wrote:#1
...What?


My exact reaction, too.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby Marcuse » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:03 pm

It's just something I've noticed more and more as a Catholic. I mean, anytime I mention being an altar boy, I have to add "Nothing Happened" or it will be nothing more than at least a dozen "Molesting Priest" jokes or accusations in the comments.


I personally think that thing is unacceptable as well. Quite a few of my close friends here are variously religious, and I've learned to respect their beliefs in the same way they respect my distinct lack of such. I think if you're getting those kind of comments then I agree with Dalek that you don't need to hang around with those kind of people.

I fully admit I see it from my point of view that others might not share but it seems nobody is willing to look in a mirror anymore before telling others their hair is messed up, you know?


That's pretty much the kind of thing I realised too.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby Tesseracts » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:24 pm

rowdyrodimus wrote:I've asked this before and never gotten an answer, only name calling and worse. This is a serious question that I don't understand and please remember, I'm not asking as a troll or someone who wants to prove a point but seriously don't understand this. Why is it horrible for someone to be Anti-Jew or Anti-Semitic (as most people say) but it's perfectly fine and acceptable to be Anit-Christianity? It seems to me that one would be as bad as the other, but if you are Anti-Semitic you are a bad person with no redeeming qualities but if you are Anti-Christian, you're cool and just a free thinker who has seen past the lies of religion. It makes no sense to me or is this just the way the world is now?

I'm not so certain it's more acceptable to pick on Christianity. I think when you experience life as a Christian you're going to notice a lot more stereotyping than others will. To somebody Jewish it may also seem like there is a disproportionate amount of anti Semitism, because that has been their experience. I know Jews who have been through horrible things and all kinds of bullying as a result of their faith or ethnicity. I also know Jews who have experienced none of that.

I don't mean this as an attack or an insult, but I'm going to be honest here. I think Christians often believe they are being persecuted and I think that is not accurate. At least it's not where I live, America. Christianity is the world's most popular religion and it's not that hard to a member of a majority. Although, I have personally never been a Christian so perhaps I'm just blind to it.

The environment of the internet is also less accepting of religion than the world in general. A lot of people who are angry at religion find their way to the internet, for the same reason that many bitter minorities like bronies and Xbox players like to socialize online.

Jewish people are definitely mocked online also, but ethnic humor is part of Jewish culture so they tend to be accepting of it.

There's one more factor here when it comes to anti-Semitism. Anti-Semites are associated with extreme ideas. People who hate Christianity usually restrict themselves to smug insults. They don't think there's a vast Christian conspiracy to take over the world, and they aren't associated with any recent horrific genocide, or attempts to defend similar anti-Christian violence.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby sunglasses » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:35 pm

I just want to point out I know someone who was fired for being Jewish. I've never met anyone who was fired for being Christian. I have met people who didn't get a job because they weren't Christian as well.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby PSTN » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:31 pm

There's also the part where Jews are both a faith and an ethnicity. I think there's nothing wrong with believing their faith to be factually incorrect, and even criticizing their beliefs (there's a few sects of Judaism that hold downright pig-ignorant beliefs). But having a problem with Jews as a people is troubling. Not least because there are people right now whose stated goals are to eradicate their ethnicity, and there have been recent attempts to do just that.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby rowdyrodimus » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:53 pm

I'm going to own up to what my issues with Jews are about and it's a completely stupid thing, I know. But here goes. (And by problems with Jews I don't mean I hate them, remember that)

My grandpa was one of the troops that liberated a concentration camp (I'm not sure which one), he was shot several times but still kept fighting. Well, a decade later, he goes to a bank to get a small loan and notices the tattoo on the loan officers arm (the loan officer was the son in law of the banks owner) that the Nazi's used to brand the Jews with. My Grandpa mentions it and the loan officer says which camp he was at, it was the same one my Grandpa helped liberate, he gave dates and info that only the people there would know, so the banker would know he was telling the truth. So you'd think the guy would try hard to help one of the guys that risked their lives to save him, right? No, he just tells my Grandfather he can't get the loan. It was something like $1,000 but to the banker he might have been asking for $1,000,000. He said that he had missing years in his credit report or something and those years just happened to be the years he was overseas fighting in WWII. So because my Grandpa was risking his life to save the life of the people like and INCLUDING the banker, he couldn't get the loan he needed.

Now to most people that wouldn't mean much. But from things that certain people of a certain "Chosen" segment have done to me, also, it was just another sign of the stereotype of the "Greedy Jew" not being far from wrong. All he had to do is go to his FIL and tell him to OK it, our lives right now would be completely different (The money was to buy out my Great Grandfather's share in a limousine manufacturing business that would've kept it in our family).

Does it make me a bad person not to trust them after what I've been through? Probably. I'll admit that. But I don't believe they deserved what happened to them or for them to be wiped off the face of the earth, either. We all have our prejudices, I guess some of us are just more honest and will admit them than others.

Edit: The thing with being honest about prejudices is that when we admit we have them, things can be talked about, discussed and worked on. When we don't admit them, they just fester beneath the surface until they eventually become hate and the hate becomes rage and the rage becomes violence. I want to work on my prejudices, I really do and I try. I'm not perfect and I slip and say things that are considered slurs from time to time, but hopefully by talking about it and learning more, I will lose those prejudices. So please, any Jewish people reading this, please understand that I am trying to become more understanding and lose the prejudice I hold but also understand that even with those, I don't wish any group of people any harm.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby AdricDePsycho » Sat Jul 25, 2015 11:04 pm

Of course there ARE anti-Christian bigots. I've never seen any discriminate against Christians, but a bunch of nuAtheists are as bigoted as the Christians they despise.

And Rodimus, you aren't prejudiced...you just met some asshole Jews. There's assholes in the best of us, to be honest. Doesn't mean them being Jewish is to blame...being an asshole is to blame.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby PSTN » Sat Jul 25, 2015 11:12 pm

The only set of humans that doesn't contain at least some assholes is 1-A, where "A" is "people who are assholes". Unfortunately, we don't really have a good model for predicting members of this set, and truth be told, we're not even sure whether it's an empty set or not.
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Re: 7 Real Horrible School Assignments

Postby Kate » Sat Jul 25, 2015 11:15 pm

On prejudice in general:
Spoiler: show
As a fellow Catholic who's had her share of altar boy jokes and had people outright stop talking to her when they find out she's Christian, I don't think it's socially more acceptable than any othe thing. It really is going to depend on your region; a Christian I worked with was fired because she could not work on Sunday while culturally Jewish people in the same job automatically had Saturdays off despite not being religious because my boss had grown up in a Jewish household. But, there are places in this country where being Jewish is a target on your back. Same with being black, though that's not how it is where I live.

Bottom line, prejudice exists against every group that is "different" and being Christian, like being Jewish, involves being different. It's unfortunate that it happens, but in my experience, we're all getting hit by it and in some places it's just better than others.


On particular family prejudice:
Spoiler: show
As for being prejudiced, I absolutely appreciate that you are open about your prejudices. Believe me, I do. But...we've all suffered prejudice along our family line somewhere. Holding on to that hatred is really no different than when someone hates white people because their grandfather was denied a loan by a white banker. Really, I've been treated horribly by people of all stripes, including Catholics (someday I'll relate the story of when my priest told me that I wasn't part of God's plan because I'm the product of a second marriage ;) ).

I hope someday you can let go of that. Especially since as Catholics, we are called to love everyone, especially those who have wronged us. I don't think you're a bad person, but I do hope this is something you can let go of someday soon.

I will also point out that in America at that point in time, people tended to "stick to their own kind." Your grandfather could have gone to another bank to try for a loan, or done...a lot of things, really. You're mad at a man who followed the rules of the institution he worked for, and while that is unfortunate, it seems that you're mad about your grandfather not being given exceptional treatment for his exceptional service. I will not deny that his service was exceptional, and I am eternally grateful to him and everyone like him who did a service for humanity. But he didn't really know that man; he didn't really know what that man could do for him or what he could not do for him. I'll also add that no matter what, freeing someone from tyranny does not mean that they owe you exceptional consideration. Victims do not usually owe their saviors.

I'm not at all trying to dismiss this. I understand that harm that has been done to your family is material and felt deeply. He served his country, he saved people, and he suffered because of it. He was failed. I don't necessarily agree with you about who failed him, but he was, and it hurt, and that's bound to leave deep scars for your family. And again, I definitely appreciate that you are aware of this. I just hope that in time, this can end with you.


To the article itself:

#7 always annoys me. As Tess said, it can be really good for critical thinking to argue something that is wrong, and it can highlight exactly what is so wrong about it. It can also serve as a good example for recognizing flawed arguments that seem convincing at first; afterall, people DID once argue in favor of the Holocaust and it was taken seriously enough that it happened and was accepted. Sheltering kids from the reality that even wrong things can sound convincing isn't going to make adults who can think critically. Honestly, before I take a definitive stance on something, I like to argue it both ways in earnest so that I've looked at every angle of it that I possibly can think of, because my first instinct might be wrong.

#4 I'd really need to know the context. I did this in a college environmental course. Special ed kids do a lot of things that other kids don't, including things that are actually...like...good. Separating recyclables from garbage could be a useful lesson, if done correctly. I doubt it was done correctly. For example, if I was teaching a special ed class and doing this, I'd put (CLEAN) recyclables in with a bunch of fake trash that wasn't dirty, gross, etc. in bins to teach it. I highly doubt this is what they did.
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