Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

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Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby nerdnerdnerd » Mon Jun 24, 2013 10:00 pm

So as most of you know, I'm Turkish and a Muslim. If you have any questions, I'd be glad to answer. I won't be offended by anything, so just ask away :)
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby Tablo » Mon Jun 24, 2013 10:44 pm

Isn't Turkey a democracy why are the protesters saying it's a dictatorship? Can you please enlighten me?
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby Learned Nand » Mon Jun 24, 2013 11:37 pm

nerd can probably answer in more detail, but basically, it's a representative democracy in that anyone can vote for the party they want, but it's not a liberal democracy in that people don't have all the same rights to religious freedom and freedom of expression that liberal democracies do. By most indices (e.g. Freedom House and the Democracy Index), it's the second most democratic country in the Middle East, behind Israel.

nerdnerdnerd wrote:So as most of you know, I'm Turkish and a Muslim. If you have any questions, I'd be glad to answer. I won't be offended by anything, so just ask away :)


Are the current protestors mostly Islamist or Secularist, or is there no uniting ideology among the protestors? Also, my parents are taking a cruise to Istanbul from Athens in a few months: what do you think of Turkish Airlines?
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby nerdnerdnerd » Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:38 pm

Tablo wrote:Isn't Turkey a democracy why are the protesters saying it's a dictatorship? Can you please enlighten me?

Turkey is a Western-style democracy, and when the Republic of Turkey was declared in 1923 our laws were heavily influenced by French and Swiss laws. On paper all Turkish citizens are obviously equal, but in practice, some groups, especially Kurds and Alevis (an Islamic sect practiced by about %10-15 of our population) face legal or societal discrimination. Now, on one hand, the current AKP government has passed laws allowing education in Kurdish, opening Kurdish TV channels and recognizing the Alevi sect. This is something great, because especially the Kurds were not recognized and oppressed since the declaration of the republic. Even speaking Kurdish in public could get you arrested 25-30 years ago.

But on the other hand, the current government also has Islamist tendencies and they also have some controversial acts: The sale of alcohol has been banned between 22:00-05:00 and the government is placing extra taxes on alcohol and tobacco. Selling alcohol 100 meters from any school, school course, dorm or mosque will be banned, which will severely limit alcohol sales. Religion classes are now mandatory for primary and secondary schools. The government is directly supporting Islamist groups in Syria. The government is also censoring porn sites. In addition to these, while there is no legal censorship like in, say, China, government critics sometimes face erroneous lawsuits and arrests.

Now, the political composition of Turkey is about %50-60 conservatives, %25-30 left-wing seculars and the remainder mostly ultra-nationalists or Kurds. Erdogan has the majority in the congress (he gained about %49 of the popular vote IIRC, and like %60-65 of the congress). He has said several times -I'm paraphrasing here- that he has the support of the majority, and he won't repeal these laws just because a minority is objecting, and the protesters should show their reactions in the elections and not on the streets. It's obvious that no left-wing or secular party is going to win any election in the near future, and Erdogan knows that. He is rejecting the protester's demands, so that's why they are calling him a dictator.

aviel wrote:Are the current protestors mostly Islamist or Secularist, or is there no uniting ideology among the protestors? Also, my parents are taking a cruise to Istanbul from Athens in a few months: what do you think of Turkish Airlines?

The protesters you saw on the news, the ones getting gassed by and clashing with police and occupying Taksim are seculars; center- or far- leftists. Those protests are directly against AKP.

In response to these, conservatives have also been holding their own ralleys in support of Erdogan and AKP, but I'm guessing these won't make the news over there since they were calm and uh, supported or directly organized by AKP.

Turkish Airlines? Well, I've flown twice and the food was pretty good, and IIRC they've been winning quite a few awards in the last 2-3 years. Wikipedia tells me this:

Turkish Airlines has twice won the Skytrax awards for Europe's Best Airline, Southern Europe's Best Airline, and the World's Best Premium Economy Class Airline Seat in 2011 and 2012.[33][34] Also Turkish Airlines has been selected Airline of the Year by Air Transport News in Atn awards 2013 ceremony.[35]
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby sunglasses » Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:56 pm

nerdnerdnerd wrote:So as most of you know, I'm Turkish and a Muslim. If you have any questions, I'd be glad to answer. I won't be offended by anything, so just ask away :)


Actually I didn't know that-I will not offer you any bananas. I also don't know what the hell "Turkish Delight" is. I think it's a candy. Do you know?
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby OrangeEyebrows » Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:28 pm

I know! It's like gelatine flavoured with rosewater or (I think) lemon and dusted with powdered sugar.
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby nerdnerdnerd » Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:55 pm

sunglasses wrote:Actually I didn't know that-I will not offer you any bananas.

Aha :D I don't know if there's a misconception like that over there, but we're white actually. You can't tell an average Turkish person apart from a Greek or a Spaniard or a Serbian or an Italian.

I'll take the banana, though. As a useless fact, did you know that bananas were introduced to Turkey as late as 1930s and were considered a delicacy as late as 1990's? It wasn't something a poor or average family could have every month until about a decade ago.

I also don't know what the hell "Turkish Delight" is. I think it's a candy. Do you know?


OrangeEyebrows wrote:I know! It's like gelatine flavoured with rosewater or (I think) lemon and dusted with powdered sugar.


Yep. It's these:
Spoiler: show
Image


It's very soft like a gel and very sweet. In Turkey we call it "lokum". It comes in several flavors like mint, rosewater, lemon, pistachio and hazelnut and is often served with powdered sugar or copra. Tastes pretty good, though sometimes it sticks to your teeth.
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby Learned Nand » Tue Jun 25, 2013 8:00 pm

Another question: so what's the deal with the Aegean sea? My parents are taking a cruise there and I've avoided calling it Greece or Turkey because I know it's disputed, but that's just about all I know.
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Terry Pratchett wrote:The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it.

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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby nerdnerdnerd » Tue Jun 25, 2013 8:50 pm

aviel wrote:Another question: so what's the deal with the Aegean sea? My parents are taking a cruise there and I've avoided calling it Greece or Turkey because I know it's disputed, but that's just about all I know.


Greece owns all but 2 of the major islands in the Aegean sea, including ones that are really close to the Turkish coast. According to international law, territorial waters should extend 12 nautical miles (22 km) from the coast of a nation. However, since Greece owns lots of islands really close to the Turkish shores, this would block most of the Aegean Sea to Turkish sailors and fisherman and Turkish ships would be passing through Greek waters even when travelling from one town to another. Turkey argues that the Aegean Sea is a sui generis case and territorial waters should be half the international standard (6 nmi), while Greece calls for a 10 nmi compromise. These maps from Wikipedia summarize it well:

Spoiler: show
ImageImage
Image


The first map is the Turkish offer, the second is the Greek and the third is what would happen if standard laws were applied.

National airspace has the same rules as national waters, so that's another reason for the dispute. Turkish and Greek military pilots had dogfights over disputed airspace in the 1990s and early 2000s, last in 2006.

The third reason is disputed territory. There are several uninhabited islets between Turkey and Greece that both nations claim.
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby Learned Nand » Tue Jun 25, 2013 8:59 pm

I can see why Turkey isn't accepting the 10 mile compromise: that cuts the northern portions of Turkey off from the Mediterranean.

Is that Aegean sea sui generis? What are the legal criteria for classifying things that way?
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OrangeEyebrows wrote:There once was a guy, Aviel,
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby CarrieVS » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:11 pm

I don't think this is the sort of question you meant, but it's been bugging me for ages. I heard, but not from what I would consider a completely reliable source, that Muslims are usually buried lying on their side, and that it's because there is a restriction on the width of a grave that's too narrow to lie most people flat.

Is that - or was it ever - true?

I don't mean any disrespect, I promise, but ever since I heard that I've had this image of people trying to bury a really fat Muslim...
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby nerdnerdnerd » Fri Jun 28, 2013 10:36 am

CarrieVS wrote:I don't think this is the sort of question you meant, but it's been bugging me for ages. I heard, but not from what I would consider a completely reliable source, that Muslims are usually buried lying on their side, and that it's because there is a restriction on the width of a grave that's too narrow to lie most people flat.

Is that - or was it ever - true?

I don't mean any disrespect, I promise, but ever since I heard that I've had this image of people trying to bury a really fat Muslim...


I'm guessing your source misunderstood something. Gravestones are supposed to be modest and there's a size restriction on that, but there's no restriction on the size of the grave itself. The grave is supposed to be at least half the height of the dead deep, slightly longer than the dead's height, and at least half the height of the dead wide. Plenty of space there. It's true that the dead are buried on their right side, but this has nothing to do with size restrictions.

aviel wrote:I can see why Turkey isn't accepting the 10 mile compromise: that cuts the northern portions of Turkey off from the Mediterranean.

Is that Aegean sea sui generis? What are the legal criteria for classifying things that way?

Sui generis is a Latin phrase meaning "unique" or "of it's own kind". In law, a case is sui generis if it can be demonstrated that the case greatly differs from other cases the law is supposed to be applied to, and thus a special and unique interpretation of the law is necessary.

According to Turkey, the Aegean Sea is sui generis, and for that reason territorial water laws should be applied differently. Greece, however, contests this claim.
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby Learned Nand » Fri Jun 28, 2013 10:42 am

Right, my question is to whether the Aegean sea actually does qualify for sui generis.
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Terry Pratchett wrote:The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it.

Click for a Limerick
OrangeEyebrows wrote:There once was a guy, Aviel,
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He tested with Turing,
his circuits fried during,
and now we'll have peace for a spell.
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby nerdnerdnerd » Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:01 am

aviel wrote:Right, my question is to whether the Aegean sea actually does qualify for sui generis.

As far as I know, the case hasn't been taken to a neutral court. So, according to Turkey it does, according to Greece it doesn't.
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Re: Questions about Islam and Turkey answered!

Postby Learned Nand » Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:56 am

What would a fair court decide, and on what basis?
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Terry Pratchett wrote:The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it.

Click for a Limerick
OrangeEyebrows wrote:There once was a guy, Aviel,
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He tested with Turing,
his circuits fried during,
and now we'll have peace for a spell.
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