Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby Crimson847 » Sun May 13, 2018 7:26 am

SandTea wrote:This place here, the comment section, is huge on "anti pc". How is this the incident y'all reverse on that stance?


The forum in general tilts that way, sure, but I don't recall gis or Jamish being all that "anti PC". The users who fit that description either have taken the same stance you're taking or haven't posted.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby gisambards » Sun May 13, 2018 8:02 am

Surely the pro-PC stance would be that she can wear whatever she wants?
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby SandTea » Sun May 13, 2018 8:30 am

gisambards wrote:Surely the pro-PC stance would be that she can wear whatever she wants?


I thought I was clear about that. I'll re-read but I'm pretty sure that was one of the points I was getting at. Or was that just a sarcastic rejoinder?

People are harshing on her for 'not being professional', I think that is silly. The proof is in the eating of the pudding. I'm just trying to say, if it shouldn't matter, it shouldn't matter. I don't want to seem like I'm attacking anyone. I apologize if I'm being perceived as doing so.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby gisambards » Sun May 13, 2018 8:45 am

SandTea wrote:I thought I was clear about that. I'll re-read but I'm pretty sure that was one of the points I was getting at.

You seem to be taking issue with people criticising the student, and then questioned why, on a forum that you say is very "anti pc", that stance had been reversed in this case - implying that it's pro-PC to criticise the student. Surely it would be pro-PC to criticise the professor for telling a woman how to dress?
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby SandTea » Sun May 13, 2018 9:28 am

gisambards wrote:you seem to be taking issue with people criticising the student


Yes, I do think it is silly for people to be so upset about this.

gisambards wrote: and then questioned why, on a forum that you say is very "anti pc", that stance had been reversed in this case - implying that it's pro-PC to criticise the student. Surely it would be pro-PC to criticise the professor for telling a woman how to dress?


To be more clear about the pc-ness; I think it is wrong when people tell another person that their actions are making others uncomfortable due to cultural normality and societal expectations. I would like to clairify that, the presumptions you made are the opposite of what I intended. I do not think it would be acceptable to "criticize" the student. But would agree that the teacher was in the wrong.

Am I missing something here? I'd love to know. If I'm not understanding why something that shouldn't matter should matter I'd be happy to better understand why that thing that doesn't matter should matter even thought it shouldn't.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby iMURDAu » Sun May 13, 2018 1:42 pm

I don't think anyone is upset by this. This student wants everyone to be okay with what standards she sets while declaring the standards previously set to be so egregious that everyone should publicly disrobe. That's not upsetting it just reflects poorly on her and is worth discussing.

Now again she shouldn't have to be judged on what she's wearing. But she will be. Even if she's self employed she'll have to present herself to people as a professional and business on top, party on the lower decks is a fashion statement.

When you want to be taken seriously as a professional don't wear cutoff shorts. It matters what you wear. If she can't even bother to dress appropriately to present a thesis why bother giving her a job? So she can not take that seriously too? When I go to work today I will not be wearing baggy workout shorts and a gigantic t-shirt even though that is what is comfortable to me and what I would prefer to wear. I want to be taken somewhat seriously.

And if someone asked me if that's what I would wear to work I'm not going to stomp off and come back nekkid. I can use words better than emotes.

Millienials need to learn that you can't just do what you want whenever you want and expect everyone to be okay with it. For all the people who are saying "you go girl" there are plenty of others who judge her for not dressing appropriately then acting like a spoiled brat by undressing at practice then the actual presentation and there are also plenty of guys who wish you ladies would just take all your clothes off all the time and stay that way. Oh but then they'd be looking at her sexually and that is totally not want she wants by undressing in public.

This long screed makes it seem like I care a whole lot about this but I'm just trying to make coherent points.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby Piter Lauchy » Sun May 13, 2018 4:43 pm

iMURDAu wrote:Now again she shouldn't have to be judged on what she's wearing. But she will be.

And if everyone just goes along with that, what "should be" never "will be". We shouldn't be judged based on our clothes. Clothes and professionalism shouldn't have anything to do with each other. Currently they do. You can either abide by that rule or try to change it. She chose the latter.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby iMURDAu » Sun May 13, 2018 6:03 pm

Image

She chose poorly.

There are still people who believe that it does and being extremist about it won't change many minds. Having a rational discussion with the professor would have been a start.

Look, I don't understand why I have to wear a tucked in collared shirt and slacks to a job where I'm constantly going outside, lifting and moving heavy things, and going in and out of walk in freezers. It isn't practical and we all look stupid imo. I feel like that collar just rubs on my neck and holds sweat there so I can smell fantabulistic. Women can wear skirts but not capris at my job so how does that make any sense? But stripping in protest isn't going to change anything except your employment status.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby Piter Lauchy » Sun May 13, 2018 6:52 pm

iMURDAu wrote:But stripping in protest isn't going to change anything except your employment status.

It's got people talking which is a vital step to any change.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby Absentia » Sun May 13, 2018 8:20 pm

iMURDAu wrote:Look, I don't understand why I have to wear a tucked in collared shirt and slacks to a job where I'm constantly going outside, lifting and moving heavy things, and going in and out of walk in freezers. It isn't practical and we all look stupid imo. I feel like that collar just rubs on my neck and holds sweat there so I can smell fantabulistic. Women can wear skirts but not capris at my job so how does that make any sense? But stripping in protest isn't going to change anything except your employment status.


Maybe, maybe not. I imagine if you could convince some coworkers to strip with you it would send a pretty strong message.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby SandTea » Sun May 13, 2018 9:47 pm

I think I've said this at least three times now so I'll stop after this one.

If what someone is wearing has zero effect on the words spoken by that person, no one should care. It would be a better world when everyone can just show up to work in whatever outfit is comfortable for them. Naked, yoga pants, or full suit.

This sorta reminds me of the rule that only dudes can go shirtless. In that it shouldn't be an individual persons responsibility to make sure that other people don't act like assholes to them. Just saying "men can't help themselves" if women were granted the same right to not have to wear a shirt is bullshit. I know no one here directly said that. I'm saying that as a lateral comparison. If it is wrong to judge based on looks/outfits, we should strive to be better. I am striving and I hope that more people will too.

I am going to leave now though because I feel I am becoming too frustrated. I hope this discussion has a beneficial outcome.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby iMURDAu » Mon May 14, 2018 12:33 pm

Absentia wrote:
iMURDAu wrote:Look, I don't understand why I have to wear a tucked in collared shirt and slacks to a job where I'm constantly going outside, lifting and moving heavy things, and going in and out of walk in freezers. It isn't practical and we all look stupid imo. I feel like that collar just rubs on my neck and holds sweat there so I can smell fantabulistic. Women can wear skirts but not capris at my job so how does that make any sense? But stripping in protest isn't going to change anything except your employment status.


Maybe, maybe not. I imagine if you could convince some coworkers to strip with you it would send a pretty strong message.


And either attract or repel customers.

I'm sorry SandTea but how you choose to dress in a professional setting reflects on you as a professional person. If someone's clothes are filthy, smelly and tattered I'm not going to listen to their financial advice. Or take them seriously as a boss if they're cosplaying at work. Sure thing "Sephiroth" I'll get right on that! :roll:

Any other time, fuck it wear whatever. I certainly do.

But I feel like if I walked around with my lower half exposed I would not encounter many people who think I'm trying to further the cause of being less judgmental about clothing choices.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby IamNotCreepy » Mon May 14, 2018 12:53 pm

I work for a large financial institution. I am expected to be dressed professionally, even though I am in a glorified call center where none of our clients can see me. Would I rather wear jeans and flip-flops? Absolutely.

If I came in wearing clothes that did not conform to the dress code, I would be told to change. If I then stripped off my clothes, I would be fired. Do you know why?

Dress codes are dumb, but they can serve a purpose. If someone is going to rebel and not follow the rules on something as simple and easy as the dress code, they are never going to be trusted with money, inventory, or the company's reputation.

Who would want to hire this girl if at the slightest provocation she would do something outrageous that could harm the company's reputation?

It's all just a game, and you just have to play along. It's really not that hard.
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby SandTea » Mon May 14, 2018 3:02 pm

You should absolutley take financial advice from a dude in smelly, tattered and dirty clothing if he is rich. Even more so than a dude in a slick suit. The outcome is what is important. If some dirty slacker can turn 100 bucks into a million his advise is worth taking.

I get that I'm being more idealistic than realistic. I would hope that is the correct thinking. If we never try to better our world how can we ever hope for our children, or their children, to have a better future? Yeah, you'll get fired, or not hired, for all sorts of things that have nothing to do with your job performance. That doesn't make it right. That is not acceptable to me. I do not think it should be acceptable to anyone.

edited afterthought- Y'all surrendering to "the way it is". I get that. I will keep fighting against the status quo though. I don't hold any animosity against y'all for just living within the rules, as dumb as I may think they are. It is currently the best way to go about living. The way it is, is still way worse than the way it should be. That is all I'm trying to get across. Even if ya don't think we can ever achieve a utopia, we can at least try right?
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Re: Cornell student presents thesis in underwear

Postby iMURDAu » Mon May 14, 2018 4:12 pm

If dude can't wash his clothes how rich is he really? I'd wager his advice would involve spending massive amounts on Powerball and the rest on mouthwash to get drunk off of.

We're making progress as a society imo. Tattoos have become acceptable and commonplace, Netflix is slaughtering cable because they aren't bound by archaic FCC language taboos, Snoop Dogg wrote a children's book, and women are wearing yoga pants everywhere. The word "shit" gets thrown around on TV and it's no big deal. I'll try not to get caught up on TV censorship because that's literally already another topic.

I like that Mark Cuban refuses to wear a suit and doesn't think people should have to dress conservatively in order to be taken seriously in business. If more people follow his lead on that issue then we're on a good path.

The majority of my coworkers don't tuck their shirt in which is part of the required dress code. It all starts with practicality. I can't speak for others but my personal argument is: I can tuck my shirt in and once I move my arms it will come untucked. I can either leave it untucked or constantly shove my hands down my pants in front of customers, your choice.
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