Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby Lindvaettr » Sat Dec 30, 2017 3:53 am

sunglasses wrote:Windy has a valid point on the inconsistency of those statements.


I think so, too. As a society, we've become extremely quick to say "Don't trust the police", "Don't get the police involved or they'll shoot you", "The police are corrupt and evil", "Cops love to shoot people". But then when someone takes justice into their own hands, we're just as quick to say, "This should have been a matter for the police!"

So what are we supposed to do? I don't mean in some idealistic "The police should be trustworthy!" way, but in a real world way. Should we trust the police, despite what we always say about them? Should we never trust them and just be vigilantes when needed? Or should we do what we, as a society, usually do, which is to say that the correct answer depends on whether or not we agree with the politics involved in the specific case?
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby SandTea » Sat Dec 30, 2017 4:10 am

Lindvaettr wrote:So what are we supposed to do?


Expect those entrusted to protect and serve to, idk, protect and serve? This shouldn't be as confusing as it seems to be.
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby Lindvaettr » Sat Dec 30, 2017 4:19 am

SandTea wrote:Expect those entrusted to protect and serve to, idk, protect and serve? This shouldn't be as confusing as it seems to be.


I covered this one already.

Lindvaettr wrote:So what are we supposed to do? I don't mean in some idealistic "The police should be trustworthy!" way


When we've decided that the police are not trustworthy to protect and serve, then what do we do?

Please keep in mind, I do trust the police to protect and serve in the vast majority of situations, even if they tend to be a little over-assertive about it based on my own interactions with them. We don't hear about the overwhelming majority of incidents where the police handle the situation properly, and almost never about the huge number of cops who are completely devoted to helping people. That being said, it's popular to disagree with that opinion in our current society, so if a person does disagree, what do they do when they need the police?
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby SandTea » Sat Dec 30, 2017 4:45 am

There are two loud minorities screaming hate/love cops. Most people are in the middle. I do feel the need to point out that even you claim the police are over assertive in your own experience.

What I was getting at is, it is incomprehensible to me why, when cops do something so indefensible that if they wern't a cop they would be put away, everyone excuses it.

Saying it's popular to go all "F tha police!" is, frankly, insulting when I'm not saying that. Espescially if talking about a specific instance where injustice was committed by the ones trusted to uphold justice.
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby Lindvaettr » Sat Dec 30, 2017 5:21 am

I'm not addressing the topic of this post, specifically. Windy pointed out the incongruities between the two viewpoints, and you said you didn't see how they were incongruous. All I was doing was explaining what it is that makes the statements at least somewhat incongruous. Whether either statement applies to the specific issue being discussing in this thread is another thing entirely.
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby satan_n_stuff » Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:19 am

DamianaRaven wrote:
satan_n_stuff wrote:Seems like a perfectly valid reason to me.


Where humans are involved, it's seldom (if ever) a legally valid reason.

The law only matters when you get found out.
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby iMURDAu » Sat Dec 30, 2017 2:40 pm

Windy wrote:"we shouldn't take the law into our own hands, let the police handle it"
"wtf the police shot an innocent man fuck the police"


I'm a bit confused by the statement. Are you saying we should police ourselves? Shit, isn't that what we're already doing but we've designated people as police? We'll just end up back there or fall into chaos.

Police don't always shoot the innocent. There's no guarantee the police would've used deadly force against the person driving this guy's truck. But pappy sure did come out aiming to kill. And his training told him to use the truest of tactics, firing a warning shot. Because that's always going to get a potential thief to resist their urge to flee. Works in the movies right?

The police imo overall as a group suck at their job but they're still the only group of people that are paid to respond to criminal activity. It's the fault of our leaders that there's no repercussions for bad police officers. I steal from my job and nobody will hire me. Anywhere. I'd be a thief that isn't trustworthy. They commit any crime they want, and have to get another police job 10 miles away. Or back in the same department they were fired from. That's not their fault and I can't blame them for taking advantage of that. Gots to get paid.

Blame unions. They fuck everything up. We've moved past the industrial revolution. But that's another topic. Because another place where blame lays is, as I've said before, on the officers who stand by idly and watch pieces of shit act like animals towards the population.

Why can we not expect police to do their jobs in a manner that doesn't result in the deaths of innocents? Should they be immune to criticism and vitriol? Is it really that contradictory to say "you have massive improvements to make because you fucking suck at not murdering innocents but we have nobody else to rely on if our car gets stolen"?
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby Windy » Sat Dec 30, 2017 6:08 pm

What if life is just full of uncertainties and there's no principle you can stick to that's guaranteed to work?
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby iMURDAu » Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:12 pm

What if it isn't?

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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby Windy » Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:38 pm

Then everyone should see why it's obvious that your enlightened way is the superior way and anyone who doesn't needs to be rounded up into camps and reeducated.
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby SandTea » Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:40 pm

I can think of one... don't shoot people. Especially when the reasoning is "maybe".
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby cmsellers » Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:06 pm

SandTea wrote:I can think of one... don't shoot people. Especially when the reasoning is "maybe".

*shoots SandTea before the heresy can spread.
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby jbobsully11 » Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:09 pm

cmsellers wrote:
SandTea wrote:I can think of one... don't shoot people. Especially when the reasoning is "maybe".

*shoots SandTea before the heresy can spread without reading the comment, just in case it was heresy.

FTFY
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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby Marcuse » Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:12 am

jbobsully11 wrote:
cmsellers wrote:
SandTea wrote:I can think of one... don't shoot people. Especially when the reasoning is "maybe".

*shoots SandTea before the heresy can spread without reading the comment, just in case it was heresy.

FTFY


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Re: Father Shoots at "Truck Thief," Kills Own Son Instead

Postby iMURDAu » Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:35 am

Windy wrote:Then everyone should see why it's obvious that your enlightened way is the superior way and anyone who doesn't needs to be rounded up into camps and reeducated.


Please tell me you didn't take that reply with a Spock gif seriously. And don't call me Shirley.

Wait, I think I messed that up.

Just trying to pick your brain on this. Not getting anywhere because you're being short and answering questions with more questions. Letting it go.
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