Democratic Primary 2020

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Re: Democratic Primary 2020

Postby cmsellers » Wed Jul 31, 2019 12:53 am

What on earth makes you think I'm remotely OK with a mandatory military draft? That's even worse. Countries with universal peacetime conscription don't only waste a lot of money and they young people's time, they tend to have severe hazing issues. And that's in addition of the immorality of making people kill and die for their government.

I probably would have been one of those people who skipped the country during Vietnam so I didn't have to serve, but at the time, most countries in the world still had conscription. Delaney's program comes at a time when the world going in the other direction: nearly all developed and newly-industrialized countries which are also democracies have gotten rid of conscription and/or ceased to enforce it.

His plan would create three massive new bureaucracies, which means it would almost certainly be around for a long while, no matter how wasteful it is, and I can tell you now that it will be wasteful. It 1. takes unfree labor, 2. assigns it to short stints at semi-skilled work, and 3. creates government bureaucracies to supervise it, three things which are notoriously inefficient.

But as I see it, the bigger problem isn't the proposal itself, it's the proposal in context of other policies the US has already enacted. With Eritrea, we're one of two countries that taxes citizens on worldwide income no matter where they live, but unlike Eritrea, we have the clout to enforce it through tax treaties. We're passing more and more laws that govern the behavior of US citizens abroad. We started with child sex tourism, which is a goal everybody can get behind. Then we moved onto corruption, which is a goal everyone who hasn't had to do business in a third-world country can get behind. And now it's a bunch of increasingly problematic restrictions which are getting US citizens banned from everything from Swiss banks to crypto trading sites on the grounds that we're too much of a liability if the government came knocking.

Most third-world dictatorships with mandatory national service either don't let you renounce citizenship either at all, or until you've served your military service. The US already recently made it harder to renounce citizenship, charging a large fee and a massive "exit tax," the result of moral outrage over some Facebook investor who gave up US citizenship to avoid taxes.

In the absence of the global reach of the US, I'd probably only move abroad in response to conscription if I planned on having children. But in the context of the degree to which the US is controlling Americans abroad, the way the US is already unusually demanding in what it takes to expatriate, and the fact that countries with national service tend to make it even harder to expatriate, if the US as it is now instated national service, I'd make it my goal to get out of the US and out of US citizenship while it is still possible at all.
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Re: Democratic Primary 2020

Postby Crimson847 » Wed Jul 31, 2019 1:34 am

If the US goes fascist, Canada isn't exactly going to be a safe harbor. Maybe a powerful US rival like China or Russia, but your liberties will hardly be safer there. If big, intrusive government is your problem, where exactly are you going to run to get away from that if the US falls?
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"If it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them; but the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?"
- Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
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Re: Democratic Primary 2020

Postby cmsellers » Wed Jul 31, 2019 2:00 am

I said I'd have gone to Canada in the seventies, to escape the draft, back when it had no extradition treaty with the US. Moving to Canada to escape the reach of the US in the 21st century strikes me as a pretty terrible idea, unless you have personal connections to Canada.

As things stand now, my first choice would be Peru. It's easy to get permanent residency, one of the quickest countries to get citizenship when you have permanent residency, and a nice place to live if you have work that you can do remotely.
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