Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

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Empire or Stormcloak?

Empire
15
65%
Stormcloak
2
9%
Other
3
13%
Not really sure
2
9%
None of the above
1
4%
 
Total votes : 23

Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby DanteHoratio » Sat Apr 08, 2017 1:14 pm

Twistappel wrote:Empire. The Stormcloaks are a bunch of arsehole Nord supremacists.

Along with the Thalmor and Lydia, they head up the list of people in Skyrim I hate beyond all reason, and go out of my way to do evil shit to.

You'd think I'd be a bit less sympathetic towards the Empire, given that they were going to lop off my head simply because it was easier than dealing with their clerical stuff-up, but there it is.

Why do you hate Lydia?
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby IamNotCreepy » Mon Apr 10, 2017 6:36 pm

DanteHoratio wrote:Why do you hate Lydia?


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My wife got so annoyed with me when Lydia was my companion.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Anglerphobe » Mon Apr 10, 2017 7:36 pm

In fairness to Lydia, taking an oath to serve any random maniac who wins the favour of the Jarl with unquestioning obedience even if he tells you to murder an innocent child or commit suicide is a pretty shit gig. I would be more respectful to someone who could order me to cut my own throat, though.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Twistappel » Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:30 pm

DanteHoratio wrote:Why do you hate Lydia?

She gets on my nerves and in my way. And turns up uninvited at my house, where she follows me around being generally irritating. And her grovelling obsequiousness makes me want to burn things.

Which is why I had to sacrifice her to Boethiah.

And yes, that is seriously all the motivation I need. I never claimed to be a nice person.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Jack Road » Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:32 pm

I'm rather fond of the slight tone of irritation in her voice.

I am *kicks rocks* swooorrnrnrnr to carry your burdens

As I have posted here before, though, I am quite fond of cloning her and throwing her off tall things.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Cpt._Funkotron » Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm

Jack Road wrote:I'm rather fond of the slight tone of irritation in her voice.

I am *kicks rocks* swooorrnrnrnr to carry your burdens

As I have posted here before, though, I am quite fond of cloning here and throwing her off tall things.


The funniest moment I've ever had in Skyrim was when I shouted a greybeard off High-Hrothgar without saving first, went to do a story mission, began to learn one of the new shouts, but couldn't progress in the dialogue for some reason. After letting it sit for like ten minutes, the brother who needed to do the thing in the scene finally walked in from the outside door, after, as I later realized, having to climb all the way back up that fucking mountain.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Delta Jim » Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:57 am

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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Malfeasinator » Mon May 01, 2017 1:35 am

Ulfric's basically a Thalmor agent. Everything he does is just setting up the Dominion to beat the Empire later.

The Empire was doing just fine running Skyrim, for a little over 600 years. So they can't worship Talos anymore, big whoop. There's 8 other freaking gods. The Empire was founded by Talos, when he was Tiber Septim, the man. Going against the Empire is then, in a way, going against Talos.

The Empire's obviously not perfect, and some hard sacrifices have been made, but they have good points that the Stormcloaks do not. The Stormcloaks want Skyrim to belong only to the Nords. It doesn't belong to the Nords; they took it from the Falmer and got lucky that the Dwemer disappeared. The Bretons of the Reach have been around at least as long as the Nords have, if not longer.

I think the weird thing we really need to talk about is how Atmora, the original home of the Nords, got frozen over? Sounds like classic Nord magical mismanagement, if you ask me.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Windy » Mon May 08, 2017 2:33 pm

People would rather side with the group that literally executes you for worshipping the wrong religion than the group that's slightly racist but hasn't actually done anything racist

When video games mirror reality.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Cpt._Funkotron » Mon May 08, 2017 3:09 pm

Are you talking about the opening cutscene where the player is almost executed? Because that has nothing to do with Talos worship, you were caught crossing the border at the same time as a bunch of stormcloak soldiers and their leader, and all got thrown together.

I don't seem to remember anyone being executed for Talos worship in the game. It's nominally banned, no punishment is ever shown or specified for violating the ban to my recollection.

I seem to remember the second largest city in Skyrim, the big trde hub right in the center, has a giant statue of a guy and a shrine right under it, with a priest of Talos going on and on about him, with no one stopping him. Whiterun isn't even a stormcloak city, unless you make a point of conquering it in the civil war questline.

Ask just about anyone, they'll tell you the ban wasn't even nominally enforced when the treaty was first signed. zthe reason for the Thalmor crackdown you see is because Ulfric was making such a big stink about it.

Also 'haven't done anything racist'? Did you miss the big fuck-off ghetto in Windhelm?! Did you not talk to any of Ulfric's subjects, how the dude purposefully left non-nords to die on several occasions? Are you unaware of the time he went up into the hills and started a wholesale slaughter of the Breton natives of the reach?
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Absentia » Mon May 08, 2017 8:21 pm

Cpt._Funkotron wrote:Are you unaware of the time he went up into the hills and started a wholesale slaughter of the Breton natives of the reach?


Those guys with the weird helmets? That wasn't Ulfric, that was me. I must have killed a thousand of those dudes.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby A Combustible Lemon » Mon May 08, 2017 8:32 pm

...whiterun hasn't declared for either side, that's why talos worship isn't banned
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby gisambards » Mon May 08, 2017 9:09 pm

Cpt._Funkotron wrote:I don't seem to remember anyone being executed for Talos worship in the game. It's nominally banned, no punishment is ever shown or specified for violating the ban to my recollection.

I think one of the Talos shrines out in the wilderness has the bodies of worshippers strewn around it (implying they've been massacred), and at another Talos shrine you'll be attacked by Thalmor if you pray there, with a letter on their leader's body ordering them to kill anyone at the shrine. Although in both of these instances, it's the Thalmor rather than the Imperials themselves.
I seem to remember the second largest city in Skyrim, the big trde hub right in the center, has a giant statue of a guy and a shrine right under it, with a priest of Talos going on and on about him, with no one stopping him. Whiterun isn't even a stormcloak city, unless you make a point of conquering it in the civil war questline.

The Talos worship in Whiterun is odd. While it makes sense when you first get there - Whiterun being only aligned with the Imperials rather than directly under their control - I think they could have done something interesting about that following the Battle of Whiterun (provided you help the Imperials win it), with Whiterun now under Imperial control and thus having Thalmor influence. It doesn't feel quite right that things just carry on as normal there, even if the Imperials take all of Skyrim. At the very least, they could have highlighted that the Thalmor seem to be fine massacring rural Talos worshippers but don't do anything much about ones in major cities.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Windy » Mon May 08, 2017 9:45 pm

Cpt._Funkotron wrote:I don't seem to remember anyone being executed for Talos worship in the game. It's nominally banned, no punishment is ever shown or specified for violating the ban to my recollection.


There's roaming bands of Thalmor that try to kill you on the spot if you tell them you worship Talos. Or if you don't grovel enough. The empire has made it perfectly legal for them to do this.

Also 'haven't done anything racist'? Did you miss the big fuck-off ghetto in Windhelm?! Did you not talk to any of Ulfric's subjects, how the dude purposefully left non-nords to die on several occasions?


That's just a fringe minority you can't judge the entire group by the actions of a few. Ulfric even lets you join the stormcloaks and treats you as an equal regardless of whether you're a Nord of a Dark Elf.

Are you unaware of the time he went up into the hills and started a wholesale slaughter of the Breton natives of the reach?


Pretty sure that was Hrolfdir's fault.
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Re: Skyrim. Imperial or Stormcloak?

Postby Malfeasinator » Sat May 13, 2017 11:58 am

Malfeasinator wrote:Ulfric's basically a Thalmor agent. Everything he does is just setting up the Dominion to beat the Empire later.

The Empire was doing just fine running Skyrim, for a little over 600 years. So they can't worship Talos anymore, big whoop. There's 8 other freaking gods. The Empire was founded by Talos, when he was Tiber Septim, the man. Going against the Empire is then, in a way, going against Talos.

The Empire's obviously not perfect, and some hard sacrifices have been made, but they have good points that the Stormcloaks do not. The Stormcloaks want Skyrim to belong only to the Nords. It doesn't belong to the Nords; they took it from the Falmer and got lucky that the Dwemer disappeared. The Bretons of the Reach have been around at least as long as the Nords have, if not longer.

I think the weird thing we really need to talk about is how Atmora, the original home of the Nords, got frozen over? Sounds like classic Nord magical mismanagement, if you ask me.


I'm going to quote myself, because I feel like I made some good points.

http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Thalmor_Dossier:_Ulfric_Stormcloak

The Thalmor have been indirectly supporting the Stormcloaks. If only the poor saps knew!

TRUE Son/Daughter of Skyrim = Nord, as far as the Stormcloaks are concerned. Nord Supremacy is their bread and butter. They're basically just the Nord version of the Aldmeri Dominion, or they're trying to be but don't have the local support or resources.

Ulfric's an idiot. He got himself captured and almost executed right in the beginning of the game. You take out Ulfric, the rebellion dies. You can take out the Emperor and the Empire just keeps on chugging along.

Dude didn't have to kill Torygg. And if he was going to kill Torygg anyway, he didn't have to use a Shout. It was a bitch ass move. It's even worse that he abused the power of the Voice for political gain, and Ulfric should have known that many people would have seen it that way. He was just showing off.

My own opinions aside, Skyrim is a tiny region of the overall Empire. The Empire has had a history of putting down local rebellions. If you go just by geography and territory, the Empire already has all the good spots when the game starts. Solitude, Markarth, and areas close to Cyrodiil. Windhelm starts out allied with snowy regions that are bad for crops, and Riften, which is such a terrible town that most people living there agree that it's about due for another scourge.http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Of_Crossed_Daggers

The Empire can bring in more troops, they're better funded, and they're not limited to just using one race of people. Other than possibly the Dragonborn, and the weird random encounter person who says they're going to join up with the Stormcloaks, Ulfric and his army are 100% Nord. If you've played Morrowind and/or Oblivion, you might know that there aren't a lot of Nords outside of Skyrim. There are a whole lot of "everything else" though, a whole lot more than what Skyrim would have.
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