The Unified Star Wars Thread

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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby gisambards » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:48 pm

iMURDAu wrote:Star Wars beloved by kids of all ages puts out a movie in which
Spoiler: show
the entire clique of protagonists dies and you don't consider that risky? Sure, anyone who knows anything saw it coming due to them not appearing in chronologically later movies but I'm sure some parents were hesitant to have their kids watch a whole squad get murked.

I don't see what's risky about that at all. The entire marketing spiel surrounding Rogue One was that it was "grittier" than Star Wars usually is, so it's hardly surprising that they killed off main characters, as that's the default way to automatically make a story more "mature" if you can't manage actual emotional maturity.
I don't think it will have put any parents off. If they were caught up enough in the hype that they were under the illusion the film was mature, then they're the kind of person who'd have forced their kids to watch it because it was Star Wars anyway. And if they weren't caught up in the hype, they'll have recognised it was just another stupid CGI extravaganza to keep the kids entertained for a few hours, and have been fine sending their kid to it.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby iMURDAu » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:59 pm

Just curious, what risks you would like to see be taken with any of the upcoming Star Wars stories.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby gisambards » Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:43 pm

For the main trilogy, moving away from aping the original trilogy would be a welcome start. While I would be surprised if The Last Jedi is as much like Empire as TFA was like ANH, it's looking like there will be more comparisons than there really should be.

Two options for what I would really like to see in terms of tone, both of which would be seen as risks, is either:
1. Actually making some effort to make it as clever and mature as the hype say they're supposed to be. They've said The Last Jedi will be darker than TFA. All this means is more of the poorly developed characters will die, they might blow up more planets or something, and some stuff might be slightly more violent than people are expecting. Rey might turn to the Dark Side for a bit, for reasons that will almost certainly be nonsense and were not built up to. It won't mean any more depth to the plot, setting or characters, which is what I'd rather see. Really what we're seeing at the moment is an intellectual property going through its emo phase - where by insisting on its own maturity despite being completely incomparable to actual examples of mature sci-fi, it's actually coming off as more childish than it would be if it just accepted what it is. Which leads on to my next point...

2. If they can't manage to make it deep - which I'm pretty sure they can't - just make it fun. I would argue the core of the Original Trilogy's strength is it knows exactly what it is: a series of movies that can appeal to all ages, but where the main audience is supposed to be children. As such, it knows it can't get to the point of maturity where children would start to be alienated, so - without losing the much higher writing quality it had anyway - embraces that it's ultimately quite immature at heart.
The plot has twists and turns, but is ultimately very simple, and that's actually fine. Characters like Darth Vader, Leia and Han Solo aren't deep, multi-faceted characters, but they aren't presented as such: they're perfect for what they're supposed be, and that's why they're so memorable - the whole thing is just a really well-done take on old cliches. If they can't make the new films actually as clever as they insist they are, something straight-up fun will have much longer lasting appeal than the stuff they're doing at the moment.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby Marcuse » Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:53 pm

I think R1 was a low level of risk. The plot was a known quantity, everyone going into the movie knows for a fact (except kids I guess) that the plans will be stolen and the Rebels will succeed. Killing off all the team is mostly tidying up why they don't appear in future instalments of the series, but it is also kind of risky to do that, just in a side movie, in a known quantity plot, with characters no better than cardboard cutouts. As much as the movie was billed as "mature" I certainly didn't expect a total party kill first time around, it took guts to make that happen even if it didn't risk too much.

Risks I would like to see for the main series? Well I'd like to see them move back to the spiritual interpretation of the Force, and have it be less about who has the most power.

I'd like it to be about Rey, Finn, and Kylo as people in this world where a third civil war in fifty years is tearing places apart and turning planets into war graves, and how they handle that.

I'd like to see Leia be a leader to more than faceless rebel analogues, and try to patch up a collapsing Republic.

I'd like more politics in this new Star Wars. I know that's probably heresy in the post-prequel world, but I didn't understand what the hell was happening anywhere other than Jakku and Starkiller base in TFA, and I'd like to know how the galaxy has rebuilt, how the Republic is organised and how well the galaxy has been run for the last thirty years before they collapse it, otherwise I have no sense of what's been lost.

I'd like the First Order to be humanised as led by insane space Nazis, but populated more or less by normal people who want to get by and think it's safer in the Empire than in the Republic. Maybe we could have Finn encounter and experience some of that.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby A Combustible Lemon » Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:57 pm

I straight up thought they blew up coruscant. I did not know until a few days later that that was supposed to be "The Capital of The New Republic". What the heck were they even thinking with that scene?
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby Marcuse » Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:00 pm

A Combustible Lemon wrote:I straight up thought they blew up coruscant. I did not know until a few days later that that was supposed to be "The Capital of The New Republic". What the heck were they even thinking with that scene?


I read in a Star Wars picture book that the Hosnian system was only the capital temporarily, because they rotate it. I assume that's to avoid them blowing up Coruscant. How they do that, and how that works? Beyond me.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby iMURDAu » Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:17 pm

Image
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby Marcuse » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:14 pm



Mark Hamill is a legend.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby Grimstone » Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:47 am

iMURDAu wrote:Shit I don't even believe Chewy was talking to that Porg.


That thing reminds me of baby groot.

And just because Rey says she needs someone to show where she fits in that doesn't mean she said that to Kylo. That sounds like something she'd say to a powerful mentor type of force user like Snoke or Luke or Jar Jar.


I think Rey does say that to Kylo and I think it's a ploy to get in close to Snoke.(pretty sure Rey and Ren are siblings or cousins or something too)

I'm hoping Finn is the last Jedi even though that's not likely. It would be a cool swerve and make his character much more important to the final film.


I like that idea. Also, this one:

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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby Marcuse » Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:14 am

If they actually did say that Snoke was the youngling Anakin attacked in Ep 3 then I would be 1000% more interested in the story than I otherwise would be.

The thing that makes me doubt the Rey/Kylo thing is that the background to the two shots is markedly different. Rey looks like she's in a darkened room, while Kylo is obviously on a fire-wreathed battlefield. It seems too out of character for Rey, who hated Kylo in the last movie for murdering Han Solo in front of her, to suddenly start asking for her help. I could buy it if it's a fakeout, but I'm not sure the movie has the guts to have both her and Finn go undercover to dismantle the First Order from the inside.

BTW I watched a vid online that showed a toy package (because we get all our movie info from toy packages) that stated Finn's FO outfit is a disguise.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby Grimstone » Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:33 am

Marcuse wrote:The thing that makes me doubt the Rey/Kylo thing is that the background to the two shots is markedly different. Rey looks like she's in a darkened room, while Kylo is obviously on a fire-wreathed battlefield. It seems too out of character for Rey, who hated Kylo in the last movie for murdering Han Solo in front of her, to suddenly start asking for her help. I could buy it if it's a fakeout, but I'm not sure the movie has the guts to have both her and Finn go undercover to dismantle the First Order from the inside.


I think she uncovers some new information about her ancestry/heritage in the jedi temple that connects her somehow to Ren. Learning this she sets out to try and save Ren from Snoke's influence and Luke makes an attempt to stop her.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby Marcuse » Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:36 am

Grimstone wrote:
Marcuse wrote:The thing that makes me doubt the Rey/Kylo thing is that the background to the two shots is markedly different. Rey looks like she's in a darkened room, while Kylo is obviously on a fire-wreathed battlefield. It seems too out of character for Rey, who hated Kylo in the last movie for murdering Han Solo in front of her, to suddenly start asking for her help. I could buy it if it's a fakeout, but I'm not sure the movie has the guts to have both her and Finn go undercover to dismantle the First Order from the inside.


I think she uncovers some new information about her ancestry/heritage in the jedi temple that connects her somehow to Ren. Learning this she sets out to try and save Ren from Snoke's influence and Luke makes an attempt to stop her.


Empire Empire Empire Empire.

The student learns about the Force with a slightly insane secluded teacher, and decides that the best way to end the conflict is the turn the apprentice of the dark master to the light. The teacher vehemently denies this is possible and urges the student to remain and complete the training. The student then has a brush with the Dark Side and eventually teams up with the dark apprentice (however briefly) to kill the Emperor.

Remind you of anything???
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby Grimstone » Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:43 am

Perhaps it will be a bit of the Empire strikes back with some Return of the Jedi thrown in there as well.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby BROWNRECLUSE » Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:59 am

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Don't drive angry now.
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Re: The Unified Star Wars Thread

Postby DanteHoratio » Sat Oct 14, 2017 5:58 pm

Has it ever been explained why Han and Leia named their son Ben Solo? I could understand Luke naming his son, Ben Skywalker, but not Han and Leia. They barely even knew Obi Wan "Ben" Kenobi.
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